Couple questions to clear up some confusion...

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03-11-2003, 02:12 PM
WA2FAST

Couple questions to clear up some confusion...

Okay... I have been getting mixed opinions on the plug that I should run and the gap. Combo in a nut shell will be a 306 with the P1SC Non-Intercooled kit, GT-40X heads... the heads take the plug AGSF32 right now. I would like an autolite part number with the proper heat range, thread depth and all of that. I have a MSD 6AL with the blaster coil also.

One other question... there is a ford PCV valve I believe (I think it's to the lightening... not sure) that is designed to be a one way valve under boost. It does not allow the crankcase to be pressurized basically. Does anybody know what that part number is and/or a better solution? I have also heard of this one way valve that you can put inline with the PCV also... I can't remember who makes it... can someone shed some insight for me please?

Thanx guys... these are things that I have been getting all sorts of mixed opinions on like the plugs, gap, pcv, all of it. Just want to see what you guys are running so that I can actually have it be right when it's all said and done with out too much trial and error.
03-11-2003, 03:26 PM
ponyboy19

you'll want autolite 23's gapped at .035 As far as the P1sc non intercooled.. well I have a ton of experience with it and i believe I read you also use Walsh to tune so lucky for you he may have learned a few things from mine. I believe it was his first non I/C ATI. Originally i was told to run a pro M 77 in front of the blower.. That was huge mistake and cost me a lot of cash in tuning.. Run a pro m 3.5" Univer blow through and your car will likely run a ton better.. i had a lot of tunning issues some of which was my fault due to bad advice and some were just the combination.. the air temps on the standard P1 will be higher.. with 11lbs i ran 20 degrees total timing with 14lbs the air temps were high enough to trip another program in the computer (this is 94-95 specific) and i ended up with only 17 degrees total.. Walsh told me to add the I/C on my next motor. As far as the pcv system follow the ATI instructions.. plug the pcv port on the intake and run a tup from a v/c breather to the pcv into a vented catch container.. basically you run all your ventilation to the atmophere.

I'll tell you first hand if your not planning on adding an intercooler i would NOT go with the P1.. the S trims and Novi's are a lot more efficient and supposedly produce much lower air temps.. Talk to walsh I would be surprised if he didn't tell you the same.

Let me know what your #'s are.. I'm currious.
03-11-2003, 03:33 PM
WA2FAST

Yea, thank you very much. I'm already all set up as far as fuel delivery goes... I have the #42's, the Univer, blow through setup, that's all good... what 23's do I need? Aren't there more numbers to them?

The pcv system... I don't understand what you mean.
03-11-2003, 03:48 PM
paluka21

Re: Couple questions to clear up some confusion...

Quote:

Originally posted by WA2FAST
Okay... I have been getting mixed opinions on the plug that I should run and the gap. Combo in a nut shell will be a 306 with the P1SC Non-Intercooled kit, GT-40X heads... the heads take the plug AGSF32 right now. I would like an autolite part number with the proper heat range, thread depth and all of that. I have a MSD 6AL with the blaster coil also.

One other question... there is a ford PCV valve I believe (I think it's to the lightening... not sure) that is designed to be a one way valve under boost. It does not allow the crankcase to be pressurized basically. Does anybody know what that part number is and/or a better solution? I have also heard of this one way valve that you can put inline with the PCV also... I can't remember who makes it... can someone shed some insight for me please?

Thanx guys... these are things that I have been getting all sorts of mixed opinions on like the plugs, gap, pcv, all of it. Just want to see what you guys are running so that I can actually have it be right when it's all said and done with out too much trial and error.

The GT40X heads have a require a tappered plug, as the AGSF32C's are, they are one range colder than stock and seem to work well and are reasonably priced. Don, is there a reason why you want to switch plugs, as this is the range you should use. I have used these plugs w/ my supercharged combo for two years now w/o a problem..granted they are only gapped at .30-.31.
Ponyboy19 is right that you will be looking at the 23 series plugs. However I think that the 3923's are the tapperd plugs that you will want for the X heads, and I believe the 23's are for a standard head. You can always go to autozone and compare the two plugs. But correct me if I am wrong.
That valve you were speaking of, the svo cars had this type of valve on them, do a search on the corral under SVO in the power adder forum.
Dan
03-11-2003, 07:36 PM
jkkj

The one way inline check valve everyone puts in comes from some place like www.bowlinggreenperformance.com?

Do a search on the corral or one of the GN web sites you should be able to find it pretty easy. I'm not for sure, but I think some guys use two and build a system the pulls vacuum when the intake has vaccum and vents to atmosphere when the intake is under pressure.

If you want a pvc valve Use a genunine Ford E5ZZ-6A666-A PCV(I stoled that from somewhere else) I think it is off of a turbo coupe.
03-12-2003, 06:00 AM
ponyboy19

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally posted by WA2FAST

The pcv system... I don't understand what you mean.

straight from the ATI instructions.. basically a 3/8 hose from your oil fill tube goes to a plastic T. then a hose goes from that T to your pcv valve.. then the remaning part on the T you run a hose that vents to the atmosphere. the only thing i did was vent both Valve covers. I use the 3923 autolights in my tfs heads by the way..
03-12-2003, 07:19 AM
WA2FAST

Okay, then can't I just vent the PCV tube to atmosphere, cap the plug on the t-body and valve cover, and run a breather on the valve cover and call it a day? I don't see what it is doing by connecting the PCV and the valve cover ventilation together.
03-12-2003, 07:20 AM
WA2FAST

The only reason I say that is that I would prefer not having extra tubes running all over the place if I can avoid it.
03-12-2003, 11:01 AM
jkkj

Actually, you have a point. Both of those places are venting the same open space. I assume it would still work the same with only one hooked up and one capped off.
03-12-2003, 01:10 PM
WA2FAST

Well, from ATI's directions, it sounds like both are open... just venting to the same point. The way that I am curious about is by just having the PCV more or less open, and have a breather on the valve cover.

The question that I have though is will the crank case be venting by itself, or will I need to do anything else?
03-12-2003, 09:23 PM
jkkj

That' it.

The problem most people have with that is the thought of having unmetered air under the pistons. It seems some people worry about sucking atmosphere(which is now in your crankcase instead of vacuum) past the rings on the intake stroke. Thus making your cylinder mixture lean.
(The opposite of blowby) Suck through I guess?
03-13-2003, 07:57 AM
WA2FAST

Right... you can't let metered air escape, just as you can't let un-metered air enter the intake at any point. That is what people have problems with. With me leaving the valve cover vented and leaving the PCV open, will I need to do anything else? They sell crank case vacume pumps... must have them for a reason, that's why I ask. What should I do? I would like to have the crank case pumped with fresh air, or have fresh air sucked through it as it is from the factory, but I don't know. I just want to make sure that by basically leaving the crank case alone and letting itself do it's thing, that I am not going to hurt anything in the long run.
03-13-2003, 08:59 AM
jkkj

On mine, you can see and feel air comming out of the vent tube, which means it is not sucking air in.
03-13-2003, 09:05 AM
WA2FAST

Okay jkkj, how do you have yours setup then? Did you follow the ATI directions and link both tubes (valve cover nipple and the PCV) together in the T and vent the single end?
03-13-2003, 09:56 AM
jkkj

Yeah, I was just a lemming. By the time I got to it, I was just trying to get it done. I keep saying I'm going to do something else with it. Your thought on putting the breather on the oil fill cap and deleting the one tube sounds OK.

I have also thought about using two one way valves so I can have vacuum in crankcase out of boost, and in boost let it vent to atmosphere. This would be a mess of tubing though.
03-13-2003, 10:36 AM
WA2FAST

Okay... so then assuming that I do the breather/open PCV, should I have some sort of catch-can or something so that I don't get oil seeping down the tube over time?
03-13-2003, 11:04 AM
paluka21

Quote:

Originally posted by WA2FAST
Okay... so then assuming that I do the breather/open PCV, should I have some sort of catch-can or something so that I don't get oil seeping down the tube over time?

Don,
I am running a K&N breather on my pass. valve cover along w/ the pcv valve the way ATI recommends..T fitting above the valve, then one side goes to the valve cover, the other side vented to atmosphere.
So far you can see a little smoke coming from the side vented to atmosphere so you know its positively pushing pressure out, and I have a little oil on the K&N filter where the oil seems to be pushed from the valve cover.
I would love to be able to "even out" the pressure inside the crank case, however it seems to be a difficult task to accomplish.

DAN
03-13-2003, 11:24 AM
WA2FAST

Thanx Dan... I think that I'll be fine running it with a breather and open PCV... that's how yours is... the two of yours just happen to have a tube between them, but they are both essentialy open to atmosphere. I guess I just didn't think that the crankcase would actually move air by itself.
03-14-2003, 06:37 AM
jkkj

It's all about the blow-by.
03-14-2003, 09:58 AM
WA2FAST

So then blow-by is essentialy what is going to be ventilating the crank case then?
03-14-2003, 10:51 AM
MichaelFreedman

Ok.... here is where Im going to genereate some controvercy... :)

Go atleast one heat range colder than the stock plug. Preffereably two. Then gap the
plugs down to .025 - .028. What you will find is as the tune up gets close (done with a chip) the ignition will start to give out up top. You will not necessarily feel it, but you will see it in the graph. You will deffinately see it going down the track. I beleive the plug I ran is Champion RC9YC (part number 438) gapped at .025 or so. If you arent going to run a custom chip, set your base timing at 24deg and leave the spout connector out. Adjust your FMU (using a bleeder and a restricter) so that the A/F stays as close to 11.5:1 over the WHOLE curve. If you get a big dip around 4500 you will lose a ton up top. Try that and let me know your results.

Michael Freedman
03-14-2003, 01:44 PM
WA2FAST

The car is going to be tuned by Don Walsh... I have #42's, Univer, and no FMU. As far as the plug goes... do you not like the Autolites? Do you really think that I am going to need to gap under .030 with only 8lbs of boost (for now)?
03-14-2003, 02:56 PM
paluka21

Quote:

Originally posted by WA2FAST
The car is going to be tuned by Don Walsh... I have #42's, Univer, and no FMU. As far as the plug goes... do you not like the Autolites? Do you really think that I am going to need to gap under .030 with only 8lbs of boost (for now)?

Don,
as a comparison of what Mike was saying about gapping the plugs down low. I was running 9#'s of boost with the AGSF32C's which are one range colder than stock. I had an MSD 6AL, MSD blaster coil, MSD 8.5 race wires, Accel cap and rotor and was forced to gap my plugs down to .30 or else the car would run like crap! Even w/o boost the car would stumble and run like it was being choked out. As soon as I gapped down the plugs from .35 to .30 all was ok.
BTW Mike, I noticed that when I gapped the plugs down to .30 from .35 the car felt stronger, I assume this because the spark may have been getting broken up, which was causing the car to have a miss fire. I am thinking when I change the plugs before I race again I am going to try a slightly lower gap, around .28 just to see how it affects the cars driveability.

Dan
03-14-2003, 07:42 PM
WA2FAST

Alright... now I am back to being confused... should I go with AGSF32C, or Autolite 3924? I beleive the gap issue has been taken care of... thank you guys, I really appreciate it. I think what is best (told to me by the pro's on this site) is that I should gap my plugs between .025 and .028, but which plugs I guess is the question now.

Thank you guys so much in advance... I really appreciate the help.
03-15-2003, 11:50 AM
paluka21

Quote:

Originally posted by WA2FAST
Alright... now I am back to being confused... should I go with AGSF32C, or Autolite 3924? I beleive the gap issue has been taken care of... thank you guys, I really appreciate it. I think what is best (told to me by the pro's on this site) is that I should gap my plugs between .025 and .028, but which plugs I guess is the question now.

Thank you guys so much in advance... I really appreciate the help.

Don,
either plug will work fine, I just eliminate the guessing and go with the plugs recommended for the Gt40X heads, the 32c's. They will work fine and honestly I can't tell you if they are any better/worse than the 3924's as I've used both..never noticed a difference.
Dan
03-15-2003, 02:31 PM
WA2FAST

Thanx a ton, I really appreciate it.